|
|
Post by frozendisc on Dec 6, 2022 19:19:34 GMT -7
At no time have I posted stats don't matter...... The club is well run..... Still waiting on your posting those complaints you had about TT's off season signings...... Are you saying that TT has made the Chargers a “well run” team or that he’s always made the Chargers a “well run” team? It strikes me that you have to look at both things: How TT is performing *today* — because people can grow and improve, and because you have to consider the upside and downside of change — as well as how TT has performed over his tenure. Neither is independently conclusive, and their action (or not) on this front probably cuts to the core of the owners’ value judgments. TT is part of the collective that runs the organization. The club is well run is a generalization for the efforts of all involved. The Chargers might not be viewed as the elite organization that say the Montreal Canadiens are, but they certainly are not a disaster, lack of PO appearances aside. They are well run...... Similar to the HC, any HC, the GM is one of the places fans look to vent their frustrations when the club doesn't win. By all accounts TT just had a very successful off season, which I would say falls into your 'today' category. Now the injuries incurred this season have clearly undermined those off season moves. So blame TT, or Staley, or J Spanos.....or Dean just because. You tell me where the blame is to be fairly and properly placed.......I truly want to hear an answer. Where is the blame for this seasons results to be placed? In fact one of you with more skill and time might just create a poll asking that very question.
|
|
|
|
Post by frozendisc on Dec 6, 2022 19:27:37 GMT -7
At no time have I posted stats don't matter...... The club is well run..... Still waiting on your posting those complaints you had about TT's off season signings......How is that relevant? TT's overall stats as GM is one of the main reasons why we made a big splash in free agency this year IMHO. TT made some good moves for ONCE in his tenure, which for the most part turned out to be shit. Do I blame him in hindsight? Is that what you want to hear? I don't blame him for that, but I do blame him for the constant failure in being successful. I do not think 'overall stats' played any part in motivating the organization to spend heavily this off season. I think it was a blend of where Herbert is on his ELC, the FA's on the market, and roster needs. It feels like things just came together, then boom.....those injuries. To me, the injury thing with the Chargers is just so perplexing.....and frustrating. I am just messing with you AF about TT signings......we all loved them.
|
|
|
|
Post by frozendisc on Dec 7, 2022 8:15:03 GMT -7
Are you saying that TT has made the Chargers a “well run” team or that he’s always made the Chargers a “well run” team? It strikes me that you have to look at both things: How TT is performing *today* — because people can grow and improve, and because you have to consider the upside and downside of change — as well as how TT has performed over his tenure. Neither is independently conclusive, and their action (or not) on this front probably cuts to the core of the owners’ value judgments. TT is part of the collective that runs the organization. The club is well run is a generalization for the efforts of all involved. The Chargers might not be viewed as the elite organization that say the Montreal Canadiens are, but they certainly are not a disaster, lack of PO appearances aside. They are well run...... Similar to the HC, any HC, the GM is one of the places fans look to vent their frustrations when the club doesn't win. By all accounts TT just had a very successful off season, which I would say falls into your 'today' category. Now the injuries incurred this season have clearly undermined those off season moves. So blame TT, or Staley, or J Spanos.....or Dean just because. You tell me where the blame is to be fairly and properly placed.......I truly want to hear an answer. Where is the blame for this seasons results to be placed? In fact one of you with more skill and time might just create a poll asking that very question. Nobody wants to answer........
|
|
|
|
Post by chargerfreak on Dec 7, 2022 8:57:00 GMT -7
TT is part of the collective that runs the organization. The club is well run is a generalization for the efforts of all involved. The Chargers might not be viewed as the elite organization that say the Montreal Canadiens are, but they certainly are not a disaster, lack of PO appearances aside. They are well run...... Similar to the HC, any HC, the GM is one of the places fans look to vent their frustrations when the club doesn't win. By all accounts TT just had a very successful off season, which I would say falls into your 'today' category. Now the injuries incurred this season have clearly undermined those off season moves. So blame TT, or Staley, or J Spanos.....or Dean just because. You tell me where the blame is to be fairly and properly placed.......I truly want to hear an answer. Where is the blame for this seasons results to be placed? In fact one of you with more skill and time might just create a poll asking that very question. Nobody wants to answer........ I'll answer. The answer is you. Great White Evil Wizard of the North that put a hex on our team.
|
|
|
|
Post by frozendisc on Dec 7, 2022 9:03:31 GMT -7
Nobody wants to answer........ I'll answer. The answer is you. Great White Evil Wizard of the North that put a hex on our team. Well that certainly seems fair......
|
|
|
|
Post by chargerfreak on Dec 7, 2022 9:32:40 GMT -7
I'll answer. The answer is you. Great White Evil Wizard of the North that put a hex on our team. Well that certainly seems fair...... The second answer for me comes down to the head coach. He is responsible for results. I have heard a lot about the coordinators. Ok, but guess who is responsible for them ? The head coach. It all comes back to him. Up down, or sideways.
|
|
|
|
Post by moekid on Dec 7, 2022 9:54:48 GMT -7
Well that certainly seems fair...... The second answer for me comes down to the head coach. He is responsible for results. I have heard a lot about the coordinators. Ok, but guess who is responsible for them ? The head coach. It all comes back to him. Up down, or sideways. The blame has to start with the owner. They have bad judgment when it comes to hiring people to run the team. That’s TT and Staley. We were all excited for the off season acquisitions but the draft again went bust, especially in the middle rounds and a few front line guys don’t make up for a weak overall roster as injuries have made clear. Staley is a fraud. And finally we have players who seem to go through the motions with a few exceptions. I am really disappointed in Keenan and Bosa. Long tenured players who should have been the leaders. Nursing injuries for extended periods. Kobe would have been back sooner. And Herbert who has become a robot. We can make fun of Derek Carr tears at the podium but that dude cares deeply. I don’t see that from Herbert. |
|
|
|
Post by chargerfreak on Dec 7, 2022 11:09:51 GMT -7
The second answer for me comes down to the head coach. He is responsible for results. I have heard a lot about the coordinators. Ok, but guess who is responsible for them ? The head coach. It all comes back to him. Up down, or sideways. The blame has to start with the owner. They have bad judgment when it comes to hiring people to run the team. That’s TT and Staley. We were all excited for the off season acquisitions but the draft again went bust, especially in the middle rounds and a few front line guys don’t make up for a weak overall roster as injuries have made clear. Staley is a fraud. And finally we have players who seem to go through the motions with a few exceptions. I am really disappointed in Keenan and Bosa. Long tenured players who should have been the leaders. Nursing injuries for extended periods. Kobe would have been back sooner. And Herbert who has become a robot. We can make fun of Derek Carr tears at the podium but that dude cares deeply. I don’t see that from Herbert. You can't fire the owners , but you can fire the other two. Time for genius, as only I can do. Ready ? Really ? Keenan and Bosa nursing injuries, and Herbert looking like he wants to die is all very clear messages to me. Something is wrong, and its head coach wrong. REACT TO MY INSIGHT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by lightsout42 on Dec 7, 2022 16:22:36 GMT -7
TT is part of the collective that runs the organization. The club is well run is a generalization for the efforts of all involved. The Chargers might not be viewed as the elite organization that say the Montreal Canadiens are, but they certainly are not a disaster, lack of PO appearances aside. They are well run...... Similar to the HC, any HC, the GM is one of the places fans look to vent their frustrations when the club doesn't win. By all accounts TT just had a very successful off season, which I would say falls into your 'today' category. Now the injuries incurred this season have clearly undermined those off season moves. So blame TT, or Staley, or J Spanos.....or Dean just because. You tell me where the blame is to be fairly and properly placed.......I truly want to hear an answer. Where is the blame for this seasons results to be placed? In fact one of you with more skill and time might just create a poll asking that very question. Nobody wants to answer........ Sorry. Day job. Budget season. My answer is this: The blame is fairly and properly placed in a few ways: 1) TT has not built a strong or durable enough team through the draft. While he has made some good picks, he’s also missed on many. And while he must to be praised for good recent offseason moves, at the end of the day, he has a record that includes a decade of poor performance. When injuries happened this year he completely failed to do enough to bring in experienced players when it was possible. Blame: 50% 2) Staley made bad leadership decisions last year (Lombardi, Hill, strategy—scheme fit with players) and only barely addressed some of them (Ficken) in the offseason. His teams come out flat and look unprepared. Fundamentals are sorely lacking. Adjustments are near-nonexistent. He’s a smart, cerebral guy that hasn’t shown he’s willing to adapt. Blame: 50% 3) I can’t fire the ownership, so I’ll just note here that they’ve been accepting of — or contributing to — poor performance for a long time. They should hire better people and get out of the way. Blame: Can’t fire them, doesn’t matter. Injuries happen to everyone. Yes, we have a lot of them. Yes, without that talent we are going to lose more. But why are the non-injured players not performing as well as they should be individually? |
|
|
|
Post by frozendisc on Dec 7, 2022 19:08:32 GMT -7
Nobody wants to answer........ Sorry. Day job. Budget season. My answer is this: The blame is fairly and properly placed in a few ways: 1) TT has not built a strong or durable enough team through the draft. While he has made some good picks, he’s also missed on many. And while he must to be praised for good recent offseason moves, at the end of the day, he has a record that includes a decade of poor performance. When injuries happened this year he completely failed to do enough to bring in experienced players when it was possible. Blame: 50% 2) Staley made bad leadership decisions last year (Lombardi, Hill, strategy—scheme fit with players) and only barely addressed some of them (Ficken) in the offseason. His teams come out flat and look unprepared. Fundamentals are sorely lacking. Adjustments are near-nonexistent. He’s a smart, cerebral guy that hasn’t shown he’s willing to adapt. Blame: 50% 3) I can’t fire the ownership, so I’ll just note here that they’ve been accepting of — or contributing to — poor performance for a long time. They should hire better people and get out of the way. Blame: Can’t fire them, doesn’t matter. Injuries happen to everyone. Yes, we have a lot of them. Yes, without that talent we are going to lose more. But why are the non-injured players not performing as well as they should be individually? My reply is multifaceted..... First the Chargers' results are average, not poor. Average doesn't get you in the PO's, and it doesn't get you a high draft slot, both of which should be avoided. TT's off season was great, but it did not work out. He needs to have another one...... The drafting conundrum has always bugged me, and I blame having J Spanos in the mix. I think TT and him have different draft styles, roster building styles, and it simply is failure more often than not. They need one guy driving the approach, and J Spanos isn't the guy, so every GM is going to be hindered. Just my thought... As far as bringing in vet players when the injuries started, how do we know TT's efforts? He might have reached out to whomever, and was rebuffed, or simply could not afford them. The players he brought in were experienced, they just lacked the talent needed. I don't think it matters much, as there were too many 'star' players out. TT failed to force Staley into getting a true DC, and handing those responsibilities to that DC. The structure Staley has in place doesn't work, and that should have been recognized and corrected last January. Staley no longer inspires anyone, and his OC is as boring as it gets. Lombardi is far too predictable, makes terrible adjustments, lacks creativity.....fire him. Hill has no business being a DC.....his defences are lazy, poor fundamentals, just nothing....and if Staley is the reason for those traits, fire him now. I do not think he is.....it is Hill. Bring in a true experienced DC and watch things get fixed. Staley gets another year, but only if he agrees to the changes.....firing him is easy at this point, so he will agree. Ownership has been invisible, so while you guys all hate Dean, he isn't the problem. I don't like J Spanos in the mix, and do believe he is a part of the problem....a big part of it. The injuries are a reality, and actually a pretty solid excuse/reason for the results.....meaning win/loss. We are looking past the win/loss and looking at the why....and the above, along with your thoughts, are reasons for change.
|
|
|
|
Post by afboltfan on Dec 10, 2022 5:41:40 GMT -7
Nobody wants to answer........ Sorry. Day job. Budget season. My answer is this: The blame is fairly and properly placed in a few ways: 1) TT has not built a strong or durable enough team through the draft. While he has made some good picks, he’s also missed on many. And while he must to be praised for good recent offseason moves, at the end of the day, he has a record that includes a decade of poor performance. When injuries happened this year he completely failed to do enough to bring in experienced players when it was possible. Blame: 50% 2) Staley made bad leadership decisions last year (Lombardi, Hill, strategy—scheme fit with players) and only barely addressed some of them (Ficken) in the offseason. His teams come out flat and look unprepared. Fundamentals are sorely lacking. Adjustments are near-nonexistent. He’s a smart, cerebral guy that hasn’t shown he’s willing to adapt. Blame: 50% 3) I can’t fire the ownership, so I’ll just note here that they’ve been accepting of — or contributing to — poor performance for a long time. They should hire better people and get out of the way. Blame: Can’t fire them, doesn’t matter. Injuries happen to everyone. Yes, we have a lot of them. Yes, without that talent we are going to lose more. But why are the non-injured players not performing as well as they should be individually? 100% spot on.
|
|
|
|
Post by afboltfan on Dec 10, 2022 5:44:31 GMT -7
Sorry. Day job. Budget season. My answer is this: The blame is fairly and properly placed in a few ways: 1) TT has not built a strong or durable enough team through the draft. While he has made some good picks, he’s also missed on many. And while he must to be praised for good recent offseason moves, at the end of the day, he has a record that includes a decade of poor performance. When injuries happened this year he completely failed to do enough to bring in experienced players when it was possible. Blame: 50% 2) Staley made bad leadership decisions last year (Lombardi, Hill, strategy—scheme fit with players) and only barely addressed some of them (Ficken) in the offseason. His teams come out flat and look unprepared. Fundamentals are sorely lacking. Adjustments are near-nonexistent. He’s a smart, cerebral guy that hasn’t shown he’s willing to adapt. Blame: 50% 3) I can’t fire the ownership, so I’ll just note here that they’ve been accepting of — or contributing to — poor performance for a long time. They should hire better people and get out of the way. Blame: Can’t fire them, doesn’t matter. Injuries happen to everyone. Yes, we have a lot of them. Yes, without that talent we are going to lose more. But why are the non-injured players not performing as well as they should be individually? My reply is multifaceted..... First the Chargers' results are average, not poor. Average doesn't get you in the PO's, and it doesn't get you a high draft slot, both of which should be avoided. TT's off season was great, but it did not work out. He needs to have another one...... The drafting conundrum has always bugged me, and I blame having J Spanos in the mix. I think TT and him have different draft styles, roster building styles, and it simply is failure more often than not. They need one guy driving the approach, and J Spanos isn't the guy, so every GM is going to be hindered. Just my thought... As far as bringing in vet players when the injuries started, how do we know TT's efforts? He might have reached out to whomever, and was rebuffed, or simply could not afford them. The players he brought in were experienced, they just lacked the talent needed. I don't think it matters much, as there were too many 'star' players out. TT failed to force Staley into getting a true DC, and handing those responsibilities to that DC. The structure Staley has in place doesn't work, and that should have been recognized and corrected last January. Staley no longer inspires anyone, and his OC is as boring as it gets. Lombardi is far too predictable, makes terrible adjustments, lacks creativity.....fire him. Hill has no business being a DC.....his defences are lazy, poor fundamentals, just nothing....and if Staley is the reason for those traits, fire him now. I do not think he is.....it is Hill. Bring in a true experienced DC and watch things get fixed. Staley gets another year, but only if he agrees to the changes.....firing him is easy at this point, so he will agree. Ownership has been invisible, so while you guys all hate Dean, he isn't the problem. I don't like J Spanos in the mix, and do believe he is a part of the problem....a big part of it. The injuries are a reality, and actually a pretty solid excuse/reason for the results.....meaning win/loss. We are looking past the win/loss and looking at the why....and the above, along with your thoughts, are reasons for change. Your love affair with Telesco is legendary at this point... He could take a piss in the Gatorade and you would blame the water boy for not sweetening it enough. Wow! This entire staff needs to be fired, there needs to be a fundamental change from the top down.
|
|
|
|
Post by frozendisc on Dec 10, 2022 8:07:22 GMT -7
My reply is multifaceted..... First the Chargers' results are average, not poor. Average doesn't get you in the PO's, and it doesn't get you a high draft slot, both of which should be avoided. TT's off season was great, but it did not work out. He needs to have another one...... The drafting conundrum has always bugged me, and I blame having J Spanos in the mix. I think TT and him have different draft styles, roster building styles, and it simply is failure more often than not. They need one guy driving the approach, and J Spanos isn't the guy, so every GM is going to be hindered. Just my thought... As far as bringing in vet players when the injuries started, how do we know TT's efforts? He might have reached out to whomever, and was rebuffed, or simply could not afford them. The players he brought in were experienced, they just lacked the talent needed. I don't think it matters much, as there were too many 'star' players out. TT failed to force Staley into getting a true DC, and handing those responsibilities to that DC. The structure Staley has in place doesn't work, and that should have been recognized and corrected last January. Staley no longer inspires anyone, and his OC is as boring as it gets. Lombardi is far too predictable, makes terrible adjustments, lacks creativity.....fire him. Hill has no business being a DC.....his defences are lazy, poor fundamentals, just nothing....and if Staley is the reason for those traits, fire him now. I do not think he is.....it is Hill. Bring in a true experienced DC and watch things get fixed. Staley gets another year, but only if he agrees to the changes.....firing him is easy at this point, so he will agree. Ownership has been invisible, so while you guys all hate Dean, he isn't the problem. I don't like J Spanos in the mix, and do believe he is a part of the problem....a big part of it. The injuries are a reality, and actually a pretty solid excuse/reason for the results.....meaning win/loss. We are looking past the win/loss and looking at the why....and the above, along with your thoughts, are reasons for change. Your love affair with Telesco is legendary at this point... He could take a piss in the Gatorade and you would blame the water boy for not sweetening it enough. Wow! This entire staff needs to be fired, there needs to be a fundamental change from the top down. Rather than make comments such as you have, focus on justifying the firings you seek, as I have in my post you quoted.
|
|
|
|
Post by afboltfan on Dec 10, 2022 10:55:57 GMT -7
Your love affair with Telesco is legendary at this point... He could take a piss in the Gatorade and you would blame the water boy for not sweetening it enough. Wow! This entire staff needs to be fired, there needs to be a fundamental change from the top down. Rather than make comments such as you have, focus on justifying the firings you seek, as I have in my post you quoted. I have several times ad nauseum, you choose to ignore or just don't listen. I get it though, you have your opinion and I have mine... At least mine are based off facts.
|
|
|
|
Post by frozendisc on Dec 10, 2022 11:22:26 GMT -7
Rather than make comments such as you have, focus on justifying the firings you seek, as I have in my post you quoted. I have several times ad nauseum, you choose to ignore or just don't listen. I get it though, you have your opinion and I have mine... At least mine are based off facts. Yes sir....we see things differently. My perception of your approach is you want to burn it down, new GM and HC......along with HC's choice of OC/DC and assorted staff. I just think that is too drastic. Yes this season was incredibly frustrating, but severe changes seem like a step back. That said, I would let it be known core players might be available..... What is KA worth, or Bosa...., or DJ even.....any of them. Until the organization fixes the draft problem, probably best to keep those players, but it is something to consider. Having elite players on ELC's is how you mitigate the Herbert cost to a degree. You just need draft picks, and the ability to draft well.
|
|
