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Post by ohioboltfan on Dec 31, 2020 12:18:34 GMT -7
So it appears to be a combination of "Agreed" and "Trust me", but mostly just a different way to say "trust" I got dat.
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Post by sonorajim on Dec 31, 2020 12:29:49 GMT -7
Oh, don't stop with Max Tuerk in the 3rd... please throw in Trey Pipkins, Dan Feeney, and Chris Watt also. How about drafted OL in general...? DJ Fluker, Chris Watt, Donovan Clark, Max Tuerk, Sam Tevi, Dan Feeney, Forrest Lamp, Scott Quessenbury, and Trey Pipkins... LOL! What was I thinking...? Pick up a proven center...? Oh hell no... we should draft one! Unless it is simple, such as a single person overriding the entire scouting systems production and making the pick as he sees it best, then finding the fix is going to be challenging. Of that list, only Lamp would qualify as a player reasonably projected to become a starter, but then that injury..... The rest are picks based in 'potential' in my view, which is not bad necessarily, but clearly has not worked for various reasons. In the end, it is well past time they invest 1st and 2nd round picks in their OL...... Clearly systemic failure. I'm inclined toward get a quality HC, and listen to him. Consistent success appears to demand this - along with the top QB, which we have. JS and TT have to trust the HC and his instincts. If he isn't producing, move on. The relationship between ownership, management and HC should be one hand washes the other - assuming that a Lombardi is the common goal.
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Post by boltnut on Dec 31, 2020 14:27:53 GMT -7
Oh, don't stop with Max Tuerk in the 3rd... please throw in Trey Pipkins, Dan Feeney, and Chris Watt also. How about drafted OL in general...? DJ Fluker, Chris Watt, Donovan Clark, Max Tuerk, Sam Tevi, Dan Feeney, Forrest Lamp, Scott Quessenbury, and Trey Pipkins... LOL! What was I thinking...? Pick up a proven center...? Oh hell no... we should draft one! , and one that should generate an extremely critical review of their internal process. Unless it is simple, such as a single person overriding the entire scouting systems production and making the pick as he sees it best, then finding the fix is going to be challenging. Of that list, only Lamp would qualify as a player reasonably projected to become a starter, but then that injury..... The rest are picks based in 'potential' in my view, which is not bad necessarily, but clearly has not worked for various reasons. In the end, it is well past time they invest 1st and 2nd round picks in their OL...... The bolded parts seem to identify the problem... it's not coincidence that our only viable O-lineman is our only 2nd round pick. And even then, I have doubts about Lamp's ability to transform from college OT to NFL OG. His awareness (stunts/blitzes) is not very good. Every year, the Chargers brass (and fans) fall in love with shiny new "playmakers". Here's a list of TT's 1st/2nd round picks since he's been Chargers' GM: DJ Fluker, Manti Teo, Jerry Attaochu, Jason Verrett, Denzel Perryman, Melvin Gordon, Hunter Henry, Joey Bosa, Forrest Lamp, Mike Williams, Uchenna Nwosu, Derwin James, Nasir Adderly, Jerry Tillery, Kenneth Murray, Justin Herbert. This draft philosophy IMO is flawed. I believe QB's, DE's, and OT's are your premium positions... and should be drafted early/often. Only Fluker, Bosa and Herbert are among the 16 draft choices. And as we know, Fluker wasn't really an OT (and most experts/fans recognized this). Is it any surprise that of these 16 selections, Bosa and Herbert are the most impactful...? You can find very good RB/WR/LB/S/TE/DT in mid rounds. The only other position that could possibly slip into Nutty's 1st round consideration would be CB... but even very good CB's can be found 2nd round and after. The GM and the last 2 coaches just don't value OL (especially OT) enough. They don't consider them "playmakers". They don't even seem to understand that strong OL's enable your "playmakers" to shine. Ultimately, it's the owners failure... since they hire the GM. There is a philosophical failure. There is a misunderstanding about the fundamentals of football. You would think that construction magnets would understand the importance of building a firm foundation (OL) first and foremost...
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Post by boltnut on Dec 31, 2020 15:03:02 GMT -7
Needs:
1. Every position along the OL. Only Quessenberry, Turner, Pipkins, and Bulaga are on next year's roster. Turner has a PFF grade of 34.9 and counts as $11.5 million against the cap next year. Should some of our FA OL be re-signed for depth? A lot of vacated roster spots along the OL.
2. Pass rush. We're bottom-10 in sacks. When you play zone coverage, you need to get to the QB. Did the secondary become that bad or was pass rush partly to blame? Will we draft DE high? Will we fire Gus and blitz a LB more often?
3. CB. I was surprised to see Desmond King get traded. He's young, he's good. His complaints were spot on... he should have been playing more. Both Harris and Hayward had bad years. Contracts are high and ending soon. Cut and move on...? Michael Davis needs to be re-signed.
4. LB. Murray seems to be a MIKE and was played out of position this year. Perryman's contract is done. Will he be re-signed? Will the MIKE be asked to blitz if Gus is not here? We could use more coverage LB's as Kyzir and Tranquil have injury concerns. Re-sign Vigil, he was solid.
5. RB. Do we need a #1 RB...? Which round...? Which prospect...?
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Post by lightsout42 on Dec 31, 2020 15:03:13 GMT -7
Especially given recent disclosures/statements by former Chargers players, I’m less inclined to think it’s about TT exclusively and more inclined to think it’s a two-vision tension issue such as Frozen articulated earlier.
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Post by afboltfan on Dec 31, 2020 15:13:27 GMT -7
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Post by afboltfan on Dec 31, 2020 15:15:02 GMT -7
Your list highlights a consistent failure in the Bolts' system, and one that should generate an extremely critical review of their internal process. Unless it is simple, such as a single person overriding the entire scouting systems production and making the pick as he sees it best, then finding the fix is going to be challenging. Of that list, only Lamp would qualify as a player reasonably projected to become a starter, but then that injury..... The rest are picks based in 'potential' in my view, which is not bad necessarily, but clearly has not worked for various reasons. In the end, it is well past time they invest 1st and 2nd round picks in their OL...... The bolded parts seem to identify the problem... it's not coincidence that our only viable O-lineman is our only 2nd round pick. And even then, I have doubts about Lamp's ability to transform from college OT to NFL OG. His awareness (stunts/blitzes) is not very good. Every year, the Chargers brass (and fans) fall in love with shiny new "playmakers". Here's a list of TT's 1st/2nd round picks since he's been Chargers' GM: DJ Fluker, Manti Teo, Jerry Attaochu, Jason Verrett, Denzel Perryman, Melvin Gordon, Hunter Henry, Joey Bosa, Forrest Lamp, Mike Williams, Uchenna Nwosu, Derwin James, Nasir Adderly, Jerry Tillery, Kenneth Murray, Justin Herbert. This draft philosophy IMO is flawed. I believe QB's, DE's, and OT's are your premium positions... and should be drafted early/often. Only Fluker, Bosa and Herbert are among the 16 draft choices. And as we know, Fluker wasn't really an OT (and most experts/fans recognized this). Is it any surprise that of these 16 selections, Bosa and Herbert are the most impactful...? You can find very good RB/WR/LB/S/TE/DT in mid rounds. The only other position that could possibly slip into Nutty's 1st round consideration would be CB... but even very good CB's can be found 2nd round and after.
The GM and the last 2 coaches just don't value OL (especially OT) enough. They don't consider them "playmakers". They don't even seem to understand that strong OL's enable your "playmakers" to shine. Ultimately, it's the owners failure... since they hire the GM. There is a philosophical failure. There is a misunderstanding about the fundamentals of football. You would think that construction magnets would understand the importance of building a firm foundation (OL) first and foremost... Get out of my brain... I got yelled at for saying something similar.
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Post by moekid on Dec 31, 2020 15:32:38 GMT -7
Needs: 1. Every position along the OL. Only Quessenberry, Turner, and Bulaga are on next year's roster. Turner has a PFF grade of 34.9 and counts as $11.5 million against the cap next year. Should some of our FA OL be re-signed for depth? A lot of vacated roster spots along the OL. 2. Pass rush. We're bottom-10 in sacks. When you play zone coverage, you need to get to the QB. Did the secondary become that bad or was pass rush partly to blame? Will we draft DE high? Will we fire Gus and blitz a LB more often? 3. CB. I was surprised to see Desmond King get traded. He's young, he's good. His complaints were spot on... he should have been playing more. Both Harris and Hayward had bad years. Contracts are high and ending soon. Cut and move on...? Michael Davis needs to be re-signed. 4. LB. Murray seems to be a MIKE and was played out of position this year. Perryman's contract is done. Will he be re-signed? Will the MIKE be asked to blitz if Gus is not here? We could use more coverage LB's as Kyzir and Tranquil have injury concerns. Re-sign Vigil, he was solid. 5. RB. Do we need a #1 RB...? Which round...? Which prospect...? 1. They should bring back Lamp, Tevi, Feeney and Turner. Everyone else who is a FA can go. Too hard to replace 9 guys. Draft Landon Dickerson. 2. We need a true pass rush threat to pair with Bosa. Get him. 3. Trading King was a fire able offense in my book. Davis has to be brought back. 4. Still an issue. Murray is search and destroy and needs to be turned loose. 5. Have to get an RB1. |
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Post by boltnut on Dec 31, 2020 16:28:24 GMT -7
Needs: 1. Every position along the OL. Only Quessenberry, Turner, and Bulaga are on next year's roster. Turner has a PFF grade of 34.9 and counts as $11.5 million against the cap next year. Should some of our FA OL be re-signed for depth? A lot of vacated roster spots along the OL. 2. Pass rush. We're bottom-10 in sacks. When you play zone coverage, you need to get to the QB. Did the secondary become that bad or was pass rush partly to blame? Will we draft DE high? Will we fire Gus and blitz a LB more often? 3. CB. I was surprised to see Desmond King get traded. He's young, he's good. His complaints were spot on... he should have been playing more. Both Harris and Hayward had bad years. Contracts are high and ending soon. Cut and move on...? Michael Davis needs to be re-signed. 4. LB. Murray seems to be a MIKE and was played out of position this year. Perryman's contract is done. Will he be re-signed? Will the MIKE be asked to blitz if Gus is not here? We could use more coverage LB's as Kyzir and Tranquil have injury concerns. Re-sign Vigil, he was solid. 5. RB. Do we need a #1 RB...? Which round...? Which prospect...? 1. They should bring back Lamp, Tevi, Feeney and Turner. Everyone else who is a FA can go. Too hard to replace 9 guys. Draft Landon Dickerson. 2. We need a true pass rush threat to pair with Bosa. Get him. 3. Trading King was a fire able offense in my book. Davis has to be brought back. 4. Still an issue. Murray is search and destroy and needs to be turned loose. 5. Have to get an RB1. 1. OL: Tevi, Lamp, Dickerson, Turner, Bulaga... if everyone stays healthy, I could live with that. I prefer an upgraded OT (via draft). 2. Round 1 or 2 DE 3. I wonder if King would come back if we cut Harris Jr. and fired Gus. Davis, King, Hayward, draft pick... probably pretty solid. 4. Vigil, Murray, White (or draft pick). 5. Draft RB round 3...? Moe draft...? 1st: CB Caleb Farley 2nd: RB Najee Harris 3rd: OC Landon Dickerson 3rd: DE Aiden Hutchinson I don't know if all of those prospects make it to those slots... using cbs site.
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Post by boltnut on Dec 31, 2020 16:31:02 GMT -7
The bolded parts seem to identify the problem... it's not coincidence that our only viable O-lineman is our only 2nd round pick. And even then, I have doubts about Lamp's ability to transform from college OT to NFL OG. His awareness (stunts/blitzes) is not very good. Every year, the Chargers brass (and fans) fall in love with shiny new "playmakers". Here's a list of TT's 1st/2nd round picks since he's been Chargers' GM: DJ Fluker, Manti Teo, Jerry Attaochu, Jason Verrett, Denzel Perryman, Melvin Gordon, Hunter Henry, Joey Bosa, Forrest Lamp, Mike Williams, Uchenna Nwosu, Derwin James, Nasir Adderly, Jerry Tillery, Kenneth Murray, Justin Herbert. This draft philosophy IMO is flawed. I believe QB's, DE's, and OT's are your premium positions... and should be drafted early/often. Only Fluker, Bosa and Herbert are among the 16 draft choices. And as we know, Fluker wasn't really an OT (and most experts/fans recognized this). Is it any surprise that of these 16 selections, Bosa and Herbert are the most impactful...? You can find very good RB/WR/LB/S/TE/DT in mid rounds. The only other position that could possibly slip into Nutty's 1st round consideration would be CB... but even very good CB's can be found 2nd round and after.
The GM and the last 2 coaches just don't value OL (especially OT) enough. They don't consider them "playmakers". They don't even seem to understand that strong OL's enable your "playmakers" to shine. Ultimately, it's the owners failure... since they hire the GM. There is a philosophical failure. There is a misunderstanding about the fundamentals of football. You would think that construction magnets would understand the importance of building a firm foundation (OL) first and foremost... Get out of my brain... I got yelled at for saying something similar. In the end, it's just yelling... and a sub-500 record year after year. There are premium positions... this much is true.
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Post by frozendisc on Dec 31, 2020 21:57:39 GMT -7
Your list highlights a consistent failure in the Bolts' system, and one that should generate an extremely critical review of their internal process. Unless it is simple, such as a single person overriding the entire scouting systems production and making the pick as he sees it best, then finding the fix is going to be challenging. Of that list, only Lamp would qualify as a player reasonably projected to become a starter, but then that injury..... The rest are picks based in 'potential' in my view, which is not bad necessarily, but clearly has not worked for various reasons. In the end, it is well past time they invest 1st and 2nd round picks in their OL...... The bolded parts seem to identify the problem... it's not coincidence that our only viable O-lineman is our only 2nd round pick. And even then, I have doubts about Lamp's ability to transform from college OT to NFL OG. His awareness (stunts/blitzes) is not very good. Every year, the Chargers brass (and fans) fall in love with shiny new "playmakers". Here's a list of TT's 1st/2nd round picks since he's been Chargers' GM: DJ Fluker, Manti Teo, Jerry Attaochu, Jason Verrett, Denzel Perryman, Melvin Gordon, Hunter Henry, Joey Bosa, Forrest Lamp, Mike Williams, Uchenna Nwosu, Derwin James, Nasir Adderly, Jerry Tillery, Kenneth Murray, Justin Herbert. This draft philosophy IMO is flawed. I believe QB's, DE's, and OT's are your premium positions... and should be drafted early/often. Only Fluker, Bosa and Herbert are among the 16 draft choices. And as we know, Fluker wasn't really an OT (and most experts/fans recognized this). Is it any surprise that of these 16 selections, Bosa and Herbert are the most impactful...? You can find very good RB/WR/LB/S/TE/DT in mid rounds. The only other position that could possibly slip into Nutty's 1st round consideration would be CB... but even very good CB's can be found 2nd round and after. The GM and the last 2 coaches just don't value OL (especially OT) enough. They don't consider them "playmakers". They don't even seem to understand that strong OL's enable your "playmakers" to shine. Ultimately, it's the owners failure... since they hire the GM. There is a philosophical failure. There is a misunderstanding about the fundamentals of football. You would think that construction magnets would understand the importance of building a firm foundation (OL) first and foremost... College OT to NFL OG is a regular occurrence, so while I am clearly not able to evaluate these players at the level they deserve, Lamp being moved to OG by the Bolts doesn't seem unrealistic. Fans falling in love with the new draft picks seems fair......a critical analysis of the Bolts draft by qualified people is what might be more interesting. Bosa and James seem pretty solid, although both have had too many missed games due to injury in my view. The rest are suspect...... I think premium is QB first and foremost.....by far. Then give me OL/DL until both are stocked up solid. Then the rest can be filled in as best as possible. Reality is if you give any QB time (really really good OL) they will pick the defence apart, even with average WR's. The flip side is if the DL gets pressure consistently, you can survive with average DB's......
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Post by moekid on Dec 31, 2020 22:31:26 GMT -7
Happy new year fellas! Here’s to a better 2021 for the Chargers and all of us
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Post by chargerfreak on Jan 1, 2021 3:21:49 GMT -7
Needs: 1. Every position along the OL. Only Quessenberry, Turner, and Bulaga are on next year's roster. Turner has a PFF grade of 34.9 and counts as $11.5 million against the cap next year. Should some of our FA OL be re-signed for depth? A lot of vacated roster spots along the OL. 2. Pass rush. We're bottom-10 in sacks. When you play zone coverage, you need to get to the QB. Did the secondary become that bad or was pass rush partly to blame? Will we draft DE high? Will we fire Gus and blitz a LB more often? 3. CB. I was surprised to see Desmond King get traded. He's young, he's good. His complaints were spot on... he should have been playing more. Both Harris and Hayward had bad years. Contracts are high and ending soon. Cut and move on...? Michael Davis needs to be re-signed. 4. LB. Murray seems to be a MIKE and was played out of position this year. Perryman's contract is done. Will he be re-signed? Will the MIKE be asked to blitz if Gus is not here? We could use more coverage LB's as Kyzir and Tranquil have injury concerns. Re-sign Vigil, he was solid. 5. RB. Do we need a #1 RB...? Which round...? Which prospect...? 1. They should bring back Lamp, Tevi, Feeney and Turner. Everyone else who is a FA can go. Too hard to replace 9 guys. Draft Landon Dickerson. 2. We need a true pass rush threat to pair with Bosa. Get him. 3. Trading King was a fire able offense in my book. Davis has to be brought back. 4. Still an issue. Murray is search and destroy and needs to be turned loose. 5. Have to get an RB1. More like find and attempt, and its going on 15+ yards down the field. If you DARE to wear #56, then your ass has to bring a LOT more than I am seeing out there.
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Post by moekid on Jan 1, 2021 11:44:08 GMT -7
1. They should bring back Lamp, Tevi, Feeney and Turner. Everyone else who is a FA can go. Too hard to replace 9 guys. Draft Landon Dickerson. 2. We need a true pass rush threat to pair with Bosa. Get him. 3. Trading King was a fire able offense in my book. Davis has to be brought back. 4. Still an issue. Murray is search and destroy and needs to be turned loose. 5. Have to get an RB1. More like find and attempt, and its going on 15+ yards down the field. If you DARE to wear #56, then your ass has to bring a LOT more than I am seeing out there. Rough night Freak? This is how you wanna bring 2021 in? |
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Post by afboltfan on Jan 1, 2021 12:01:43 GMT -7
I think Murray looks like a rookie with room for improvement. I also see him playing for a lame duck DC that is likely looking ahead to his next job.
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