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Post by boltnut on Mar 7, 2019 20:21:19 GMT -7
Once you get passed Cajuste... I think they're all RT-only. @60, I don't think Howard would be BPA. If Howard/Scharping were there in the 3rd, I might consider them. But I think, even in the 3rd, there will be better players there. We'll see. I agree completely, and think TT should be targeting an OT that is a ROT only. TT isn't going to get a shot at a LOT this draft, so just make sure you fix the ROT need. Yeah, I've come to that realization also. And it pains me to say that... you know my penchant for OT's in the 1st round. @28... that's what happens.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 7, 2019 20:22:58 GMT -7
Really curious as to just who was still on the board when you made Lawrence the pick. Nothing against Butler, but I think he goes before the 60th pick. HH, MW, Cantrell, Butler.....no KA ? Seems unlikely. Do you envision Savage becoming the starter ? I like the Brailford pick...... I do not think Hyatt falls into the 5th rd, much less to 166th, but if he does there is great value. ROT only....in my view. Cashman I need to look at..... Dean has had three major knee injuries, and still has that speed. Long arms, doesn't like to tackle.....but that speed....some GM will take him 5th or 6th rd. I'm passing on some LB's (Bush, Wilson) because I think Perryman gets re-signed. And I think there are some late gems in the later rounds that will make great backups with starter potential. I'm passing safeties (Thompson, Adderly) because I think Savage will eventually be just as good (value) and I'm passing up some 3-techs (Gary, Tillery, Jones, Simmons) because I believe Lawrence will be the next Jamaal Williams. I think he's that good. I also believe that Wilkins will be gone by #28. Now if Wilkins or Dillard are there... different story. Butler may not be there by #60 (especially considering his combine). But I've got 8 or 9 really good (fast, physical) WR's that rate similar (N'Keal Harry included) within the 1st two rounds. If teams have over-drafted WR's, then I start looking for gems in the later rounds and use my 2nd rounder on another position (BPA). I think Savage becomes an eventual starter. TT seems to have his heart set on Watkins. We'll see. With his injury, I'd like to see depth there... and move on from Addae... and his salary. Hyatt may not fall to the late 5th. But see my previous post... Thanks for the feedback, guys. Are you saying Lawrence is BPA when TT picks, or are you just seeing talent that really addresses a need, and leaving on the board better talent at positions with less need ?
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Post by boltnut on Mar 7, 2019 21:35:40 GMT -7
I'm saying that I believe Lawrence is a top-30 guy for me. It's hard to find a guy at 340 lbs. that athletic. Immoveable rock that keeps your LB's clean. He effects the whole defense. He makes everyone behind him better. Tom Brady will never climb the pocket again... the Patriots will never run for 150+ on us again. He's Vince Wilfork (#21 pick) only more athletic. He's Danny Shelton (#12 pick) only better pass rusher. He's the J-Wall we've craved for the last 10 years.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 8, 2019 8:02:39 GMT -7
I'm saying that I believe Lawrence is a top-30 guy for me. It's hard to find a guy at 340 lbs. that athletic. Immoveable rock that keeps your LB's clean. He effects the whole defense. He makes everyone behind him better. Tom Brady will never climb the pocket again... the Patriots will never run for 150+ on us again. He's Vince Wilfork (#21 pick) only more athletic. He's Danny Shelton (#12 pick) only better pass rusher. He's the J-Wall we've craved for the last 10 years. I don't see it to the level you are......Lawrence seems like he is a 2nd rd guy to me, mid 2nd rd.....so if TT really wants him, 1st is what it needs to be. McGary, Ivey and even WR Butler might be better choices.....I like Risner as well, but not in the 1st rd. 28th is a tough spot.....BPA ? PON ? could mean a very wide range of players.
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Post by woodeye on Mar 8, 2019 8:05:59 GMT -7
I'm saying that I believe Lawrence is a top-30 guy for me. It's hard to find a guy at 340 lbs. that athletic. Immoveable rock that keeps your LB's clean. He effects the whole defense. He makes everyone behind him better. Tom Brady will never climb the pocket again... the Patriots will never run for 150+ on us again. He's Vince Wilfork (#21 pick) only more athletic. He's Danny Shelton (#12 pick) only better pass rusher. He's the J-Wall we've craved for the last 10 years. I don't see it to the level you are......Lawrence seems like he is a 2nd rd guy to me, mid 2nd rd.....so if TT really wants him, 1st is what it needs to be. McGary, Ivey and even WR Butler might be better choices.....I like Risner as well, but not in the 1st rd. 28th is a tough spot.....BPA ? PON ? could mean a very wide range of players. Interesting. I believe the problem is perception. Lawrence is so far beyond Vita Vea. I am glad TB bit on that one.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 8, 2019 8:22:43 GMT -7
I don't see it to the level you are......Lawrence seems like he is a 2nd rd guy to me, mid 2nd rd.....so if TT really wants him, 1st is what it needs to be. McGary, Ivey and even WR Butler might be better choices.....I like Risner as well, but not in the 1st rd. 28th is a tough spot.....BPA ? PON ? could mean a very wide range of players. Interesting. I believe the problem is perception. Lawrence is so far beyond Vita Vea. I am glad TB bit on that one. There isn't a problem..... We simply have a different grade on the player.
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Post by woodeye on Mar 8, 2019 8:28:20 GMT -7
Interesting. I believe the problem is perception. Lawrence is so far beyond Vita Vea. I am glad TB bit on that one. There isn't a problem..... We simply have a different grade on the player. One thing I will say about Fant. He is not just a receiving TE. Ferentz at Iowa demands tha t TEs block.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 8, 2019 9:25:03 GMT -7
There isn't a problem..... We simply have a different grade on the player. One thing I will say about Fant. He is not just a receiving TE. Ferentz at Iowa demands tha t TEs block. That is an attribute that is important in any possible two TE sets with Fant and HH. Both can be receiving threats, or solid blockers.....Wiz would need to get creative.
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Post by woodeye on Mar 8, 2019 9:48:14 GMT -7
One thing I will say about Fant. He is not just a receiving TE. Ferentz at Iowa demands tha t TEs block. That is an attribute that is important in any possible two TE sets with Fant and HH. Both can be receiving threats, or solid blockers.....Wiz would need to get creative. Yes. Yes. They can help Tevi. Oline no longer PON. LOL. |
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 8, 2019 9:51:45 GMT -7
That is an attribute that is important in any possible two TE sets with Fant and HH. Both can be receiving threats, or solid blockers.....Wiz would need to get creative. Yes. Yes. They can help Tevi. Oline no longer PON. LOL. Tevi is beyond helping....... OL will always be a need I fear...... Malik Jackson getting released......
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Post by sonorajim on Mar 8, 2019 10:01:01 GMT -7
I don't see it to the level you are......Lawrence seems like he is a 2nd rd guy to me, mid 2nd rd.....so if TT really wants him, 1st is what it needs to be. McGary, Ivey and even WR Butler might be better choices.....I like Risner as well, but not in the 1st rd. 28th is a tough spot.....BPA ? PON ? could mean a very wide range of players. Interesting. I believe the problem is perception. Lawrence is so far beyond Vita Vea. I am glad TB bit on that one. Lawrence has elite physical ability but has been inconsistent on technique. His eval depends on what we make of his ability to develop under an NFL coaching staff. Probably goes 2nd rd.
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Post by woodeye on Mar 8, 2019 10:15:24 GMT -7
Interesting. I believe the problem is perception. Lawrence is so far beyond Vita Vea. I am glad TB bit on that one. Lawrence has elite physical ability but has been inconsistent on technique. His eval depends on what we make of his ability to develop under an NFL coaching staff. Probably goes 2nd rd. 23 overall per NFLDraftScout.com. Brugler has him as about the 6th best DT just below DreMont Jones. BPA vs PON will be big this year, especially in close calls. We have specific areas that are weak. There are other factors, which I will pull all together soon. tl;dr I have Dexta going to LAC @28.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 8, 2019 10:33:26 GMT -7
Lawrence has elite physical ability but has been inconsistent on technique. His eval depends on what we make of his ability to develop under an NFL coaching staff. Probably goes 2nd rd. 23 overall per NFLDraftScout.com. Brugler has him as about the 6th best DT just below DreMont Jones. BPA vs PON will be big this year, especially in close calls. We have specific areas that are weak. There are other factors, which I will pull all together soon.tl;dr I have Dexta going to LAC @28. Yea, we all know your mock is out in a few weeks.......
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Post by ltocbolts on Mar 8, 2019 11:28:37 GMT -7
I'm saying that I believe Lawrence is a top-30 guy for me. It's hard to find a guy at 340 lbs. that athletic. Immoveable rock that keeps your LB's clean. He effects the whole defense. He makes everyone behind him better. Tom Brady will never climb the pocket again... the Patriots will never run for 150+ on us again. He's Vince Wilfork (#21 pick) only more athletic. He's Danny Shelton (#12 pick) only better pass rusher. He's the J-Wall we've craved for the last 10 years. Dang -- this here is some high praise. Definitely going to look into it. . . . .
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Post by boltnut on Mar 8, 2019 18:35:32 GMT -7
I'm saying that I believe Lawrence is a top-30 guy for me. It's hard to find a guy at 340 lbs. that athletic. Immoveable rock that keeps your LB's clean. He effects the whole defense. He makes everyone behind him better. Tom Brady will never climb the pocket again... the Patriots will never run for 150+ on us again. He's Vince Wilfork (#21 pick) only more athletic. He's Danny Shelton (#12 pick) only better pass rusher. He's the J-Wall we've craved for the last 10 years. I don't see it to the level you are......Lawrence seems like he is a 2nd rd guy to me, mid 2nd rd.....so if TT really wants him, 1st is what it needs to be. McGary, Ivey and even WR Butler might be better choices.....I like Risner as well, but not in the 1st rd. 28th is a tough spot.....BPA ? PON ? could mean a very wide range of players. I think Lawrence does a lot of the little things people don't notice. Clemson's run defense has been top-10 the 3 years Lawrence has been there. Some of that credit can be given to Christian Wilkins and Clelin Ferrell. But both of those guys were allowed to shoot gaps because Lawrence was that rock that took on two OL much of the time. I actually believe Clemson played him out of position (3-tech much of the time). They put him on the right side (head up on the LG) and made teams double team him with either the LT (advantage Ferrell) or the center (advantage Wilkins... who played a lot of 1-tech/0-tech). Put Lawrence in the 1-gap (on Bosa's side... in Mebane's position) and I believe he helps keep LB's clean (a big problem for us last year) and/or garners more 1-on-1's for Bosa. If you watch the Clemson/NC State tape, there were very few times Lawrence and Bradbury got a 1-on-1 matchup. The few times it happened, Bradbury had a very tough time handling Lawrence (and I really like Bradbury... who did a very nice job on Wilkins). My point... teams will have to double Lawrence... he's just too much to handle 1-on-1... even for top college/NFL OL. I haven't watched a lot of McGary or Ivey. But I was not impressed with McGary's Senior Bowl drills. And Ivey seems a bit slow-footed in the small sample size of tape I've seen. Butler I'm keen on (but not a 1st rounder for me). Risner alright (RT-only... feet too slow for LT) but also gets a 2nd round grade from me. 28th is a tough spot. The Patriots routinely pick from the back. And they pick a lot of DL and OL from there. Most of your top-level athletes/playmakers will be gone. The next step could be picking up core/skeletal players to hang your athletes/playmakers from...
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