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Post by lightsout42 on Jan 29, 2020 8:46:00 GMT -7
If the Chargers tag Rivers, then he can retire, play in LA, or sell a team on a deal with the Chargers. The Chargers may tag Rivers but I think that is unlikely. No team will trade for a 38 year old turnover machine that has been franchised tagged. Perhaps, or perhaps it’s a trade deal on a 2-year that isn’t for 2 #1s.
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Post by lightsout42 on Jan 29, 2020 8:50:09 GMT -7
That’s absurd and illogical. A record is but one indicator. If the record were everything, why have playoff games unless the top two were tied in every way? The system is not set up to compare records other than for seating in the PO's. So they play it out. Generally, most teams in the PO have not met head to head. So they play it out. Otherwise, based on your argument, a 5-11 team is actually a SB contender who lost games due to conditions outside their control. Do you actually think the bolts are a SB contender? I get the idea that there are a lot of factors that contribute, (how complex an organism the NFL is debateable) but in the end, if you cannot win the game via skill, coaching, and strategy, you are what your record says you are. The extension of my argument is not that a 5-11 team is a Super Bowl contender. The extension of my argument is that complex systems are complex, and records are merely one indicator of the measured organism. It might be the one you care about, but it’s certainly not the only one.
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Post by frozendisc on Jan 29, 2020 9:00:26 GMT -7
If the Chargers tag Rivers, then he can retire, play in LA, or sell a team on a deal with the Chargers. The Chargers may tag Rivers but I think that is unlikely. No team will trade for a 38 year old turnover machine that has been franchised tagged. They could tag him, forcing a play or retire decision, hoping he chooses to play. I am in agreement with you though, I don't see a tag coming, unless it is out of spite.
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Post by totallybolted on Jan 29, 2020 9:15:46 GMT -7
The system is not set up to compare records other than for seating in the PO's. So they play it out. Generally, most teams in the PO have not met head to head. So they play it out. Otherwise, based on your argument, a 5-11 team is actually a SB contender who lost games due to conditions outside their control. Do you actually think the bolts are a SB contender? I get the idea that there are a lot of factors that contribute, (how complex an organism the NFL is debateable) but in the end, if you cannot win the game via skill, coaching, and strategy, you are what your record says you are. The extension of my argument is not that a 5-11 team is a Super Bowl contender. The extension of my argument is that complex systems are complex, and records are merely one indicator of the measured organism. It might be the one you care about, but it’s certainly not the only one. I figured that is where you were coming from however, I was making that extension. I think that if you argue that you are not what your record is, as in a 12-4 team really wasn't that good, must also mean that a 5-11 one isn't a bad one either. Thus the SB contender. I choose to stretch it out as the logical conclusion. Though I see you are not taking it that far. which I can agree is reasonable.
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Post by moekid on Jan 29, 2020 9:39:33 GMT -7
You are what your record is - Bill Parcells That’s absurd and illogical. A record is but one indicator. If the record were everything, why have playoff games unless the top two were tied in every way? It’s the only objective measure that matters. Wins and losses. Everything else is speculation.
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Post by chargerfreak on Jan 29, 2020 10:42:26 GMT -7
That’s absurd and illogical. A record is but one indicator. If the record were everything, why have playoff games unless the top two were tied in every way? It’s the only objective measure that matters. Wins and losses. Everything else is speculation. Winning Isn't Everything; It's the Only Thing. -Vince Lombardi
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Post by moekid on Jan 29, 2020 10:51:43 GMT -7
The system is not set up to compare records other than for seating in the PO's. So they play it out. Generally, most teams in the PO have not met head to head. So they play it out. Otherwise, based on your argument, a 5-11 team is actually a SB contender who lost games due to conditions outside their control. Do you actually think the bolts are a SB contender? I get the idea that there are a lot of factors that contribute, (how complex an organism the NFL is debateable) but in the end, if you cannot win the game via skill, coaching, and strategy, you are what your record says you are. The extension of my argument is not that a 5-11 team is a Super Bowl contender. The extension of my argument is that complex systems are complex, and records are merely one indicator of the measured organism. It might be the one you care about, but it’s certainly not the only one. It's the only one that matters.
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Post by moekid on Jan 29, 2020 10:54:44 GMT -7
The Chargers may tag Rivers but I think that is unlikely. No team will trade for a 38 year old turnover machine that has been franchised tagged. They could tag him, forcing a play or retire decision, hoping he chooses to play. I am in agreement with you though, I don't see a tag coming, unless it is out of spite. If they can't agree on a deal and can tag him, they should. Even if they don't want him. It's an asset they can trade later. They should have signed Brees and traded either he or Rivers in July to a desperate club. Should have done the same with Michael Turner. Stop letting assets walk
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Post by lightsout42 on Jan 29, 2020 11:01:14 GMT -7
The extension of my argument is not that a 5-11 team is a Super Bowl contender. The extension of my argument is that complex systems are complex, and records are merely one indicator of the measured organism. It might be the one you care about, but it’s certainly not the only one. It's the only one that matters. * In your opinion.
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Post by chargerfreak on Jan 29, 2020 11:20:43 GMT -7
The Chargers may tag Rivers but I think that is unlikely. No team will trade for a 38 year old turnover machine that has been franchised tagged. They could tag him, forcing a play or retire decision, hoping he chooses to play. I am in agreement with you though, I don't see a tag coming, unless it is out of spite. Spite ? There's no spite. Its business. Its too bad you aren't in the sports business to understand that....................... Spite ? He's 390 years old and we need to rent a year out of him.
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Post by totallybolted on Jan 29, 2020 11:57:37 GMT -7
They could tag him, forcing a play or retire decision, hoping he chooses to play. I am in agreement with you though, I don't see a tag coming, unless it is out of spite. If they can't agree on a deal and can tag him, they should. Even if they don't want him. It's an asset they can trade later. They should have signed Brees and traded either he or Rivers in July to a desperate club. Should have done the same with Michael Turner. Stop letting assets walk For sentimental keeps...
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Post by Chargeroo on Jan 29, 2020 12:25:32 GMT -7
That’s absurd and illogical. A record is but one indicator. If the record were everything, why have playoff games unless the top two were tied in every way? You are what your playoff record is too. That sounds like good news for us - we didn't lose even one playoff game this season! What a team!
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Post by sonorajim on Jan 29, 2020 13:00:08 GMT -7
You are what your record is - Bill Parcells True. Speculating on what a team might have been if things had been different has little to do with existing reality. Things are different every year, every game, etc. Either you were ready or you were not.
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Post by sonorajim on Jan 29, 2020 13:04:26 GMT -7
Buncha duckbill platitudes. Right now, what are the Chargers ? Who are the Chargers ? Are they who their record was in 2019 ? in 2018 ?Never has a Charger off season been so transformative. It is all to be determined. Nothing is etched in stone. At this moment, all is on the table. No one has any idea what our 2020 record will be. The personnel decisions between now and May will be fateful. None of the above. They will be who they are in 2020. Lots of apparently favorable opportunities. Good luck with your choices Tom y John.
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Post by frozendisc on Jan 29, 2020 18:17:41 GMT -7
They could tag him, forcing a play or retire decision, hoping he chooses to play. I am in agreement with you though, I don't see a tag coming, unless it is out of spite. If they can't agree on a deal and can tag him, they should. Even if they don't want him. It's an asset they can trade later. They should have signed Brees and traded either he or Rivers in July to a desperate club. Should have done the same with Michael Turner. Stop letting assets walk I understand playing that out to a finality.......but I am not too sure any would play along with you. Rivers just retires, any clubs that might have had interest go another way. It is a nice thought, but all involved know the process as well as TT does.
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