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Post by chargerfreak on Nov 19, 2021 10:26:22 GMT -7
I agree with your general premise. IF we miss the playoffs...........................gone or hot seat I'll predict. I'll even tell you why. We have had CRAZY injuries over the years that has saved his ass. Not this year, so what's the problem will be the question asked. The problem..... In my view it continues to be a lack of talent throughout the roster. I would combine that with the slide of Staley into 'disappointment' category. 9 games does not make a career. Sheesh.
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Post by totallybolted on Nov 19, 2021 13:00:17 GMT -7
I'd argue TB, KC, and Buff are only recently showing talent across the board. So are their GM's new? Dallas.....meh not seeing it. So the rest are all also settling for Mediocre? Pitt? Pitt has a very good GM. He's been there a while. Dallas is a top flight team in the NFL. The defense was horrible last year, and in one offseason they turned it around---impressive. Green bay did the same thing on defense. They are probably the two most balanced teams in the league right now. They did that in ONE offseason. We haven't done it in 10 offseasons. Think of that. Is that the measure? One season turnaround? Is it consistently making the PO? or is it going numerous seasons without the PO or is it without a winning record? Seems rather subjective to me. In the least its all over the map from a fan perspective. I wonder what the standard is for owners to measure. I don't envy the GM position (except the money). Oh and SPANOS' suck as owners
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Post by totallybolted on Nov 19, 2021 13:02:10 GMT -7
The problem..... In my view it continues to be a lack of talent throughout the roster. I would combine that with the slide of Staley into 'disappointment' category. 9 games does not make a career. Sheesh. He is still 5-4?
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Post by chargerfreak on Nov 19, 2021 13:25:26 GMT -7
Pitt has a very good GM. He's been there a while. Dallas is a top flight team in the NFL. The defense was horrible last year, and in one offseason they turned it around---impressive. Green bay did the same thing on defense. They are probably the two most balanced teams in the league right now. They did that in ONE offseason. We haven't done it in 10 offseasons. Think of that. or is it going numerous seasons without the PO or is it without a winning record? Seems rather subjective to me. In the least its all over the map from a fan perspective. I wonder what the standard is for owners to measure. I don't envy the GM position (except the money). Oh and SPANOS' suck as owners Well, we haven't done any of it.
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Post by frozendisc on Nov 19, 2021 20:01:03 GMT -7
What decisions are being made by Dean that impact daily operations? Now if you are including the decisions/influences being made by J Spanos, then I am in agreement.....he is a problem. They are responsible for every single thing in the organization. Everyone they hire is responsible for getting results for the job they are hired to do. If the roster isn’t up to snuff, as you have said for every season, they are responsible for either investing in help that TT needs or replacing him. And so on down the line. That’s how business works I do not believe Dean micromanages the operation. I do believe J Spanos picks his areas he wants to influence, and does so heavily. I have no 'proof' on that, so do not ask. After we acknowledge the 'Owner' is responsible for all, let us get to the brass tacks of this. Yes, this roster has been less than for years, my opinion. The issue is what to do about it. The responses to 'what to do about it' cover the entire spectrum, but the bottom line is TT made his choices (or choices were made) and....this is key.....they liked their choices made. Now hindsight has allowed us to complain or praise the choices, but TT et al do not get the benefit of hindsight prior to making the decisions/choices. That is how real life works..... *I have always thought there was something systemically wrong in the Chargers scouting of OL, but being this far away.....not a chance I could ever identify it. Maybe it has been fixed, but Slater was a top round one guy, so let me see some success from rounds 3 and 4.
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Post by frozendisc on Nov 19, 2021 20:03:08 GMT -7
The problem..... In my view it continues to be a lack of talent throughout the roster. I would combine that with the slide of Staley into 'disappointment' category. 9 games does not make a career. Sheesh. Correct, but the shine is definitely dulling....... Don't get me wrong, I still like the hire and am hoping he proves to be a great HC.
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Post by moekid on Nov 19, 2021 20:06:24 GMT -7
They are responsible for every single thing in the organization. Everyone they hire is responsible for getting results for the job they are hired to do. If the roster isn’t up to snuff, as you have said for every season, they are responsible for either investing in help that TT needs or replacing him. And so on down the line. That’s how business works I do not believe Dean micromanages the operation. I do believe J Spanos picks his areas he wants to influence, and does so heavily. I have no 'proof' on that, so do not ask. After we acknowledge the 'Owner' is responsible for all, let us get to the brass tacks of this. Yes, this roster has been less than for years, my opinion. The issue is what to do about it. The responses to 'what to do about it' cover the entire spectrum, but the bottom line is TT made his choices (or choices were made) and....this is key.....they liked their choices made. Now hindsight has allowed us to complain or praise the choices, but TT et al do not get the benefit of hindsight prior to making the decisions/choices. That is how real life works..... *I have always thought there was something systemically wrong in the Chargers scouting of OL, but being this far away.....not a chance I could ever identify it. Maybe it has been fixed, but Slater was a top round one guy, so let me see some success from rounds 3 and 4. If you’re Spanos and you believe the roster has been deficient for years on end, what do you do? Stick with the same guy who’s been creating the roster? Move on? Or do you really care whether your team wins or not? Is that the most important thing in the world to you or are you ok with occasional winning seasons and an appearance in the playoffs as long as the business of the Chargers is good? What’s the burning priority for Dean Spanos? |
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Post by frozendisc on Nov 20, 2021 7:25:46 GMT -7
I do not believe Dean micromanages the operation. I do believe J Spanos picks his areas he wants to influence, and does so heavily. I have no 'proof' on that, so do not ask. After we acknowledge the 'Owner' is responsible for all, let us get to the brass tacks of this. Yes, this roster has been less than for years, my opinion. The issue is what to do about it. The responses to 'what to do about it' cover the entire spectrum, but the bottom line is TT made his choices (or choices were made) and....this is key.....they liked their choices made. Now hindsight has allowed us to complain or praise the choices, but TT et al do not get the benefit of hindsight prior to making the decisions/choices. That is how real life works..... *I have always thought there was something systemically wrong in the Chargers scouting of OL, but being this far away.....not a chance I could ever identify it. Maybe it has been fixed, but Slater was a top round one guy, so let me see some success from rounds 3 and 4. If you’re Spanos and you believe the roster has been deficient for years on end, what do you do? Stick with the same guy who’s been creating the roster? Move on? Or do you really care whether your team wins or not? Is that the most important thing in the world to you or are you ok with occasional winning seasons and an appearance in the playoffs as long as the business of the Chargers is good? What’s the burning priority for Dean Spanos? "What do you do" is the issue.....and there is only one correct answer buried in a ton of incorrect answers. Thirty one clubs get it wrong, and only one gets it right each year. But that is not what most are speaking about here, it is more about becoming that model of consistency.....making the PO's each year, having a shot. Ownership does set the expectation, and if that expectation prioritizes earnings or financial stability, you probably see 'safe' approaches to most all money decisions. I have zero idea what Dean Spanos believes, or wants, from his club. One can look to different sources, and it appears the Chargers spend well above average, or close to the cap for players. Beyond that, it is difficult to determine a financial personality for the Charger organization, if you will allow that term. In the end, I do not believe 'money' or spending is the issue preventing that consistency being sought. So if it is not money, then it is personnel.....do they have the 'right' people. This opens the door for all the criticism directed towards TT, and as the GM it is part of the territory. Decisions....how are they obtained? So with the draft, it is virtually always a collective decision. In fact I have never been in the room and seen a GM, or Owner for that matter, go off script and just decide. It just doesn't happen, there is far too much invested in the process to out of the blue reject that investment. Drafting decisions is easy, the hard one is FA's.... The perfect FA is available, perfect fit, attitude, age.....everything is perfect for your club. GM reaches out to the agent, tells him the vault is open, just tell us how much. Agent replies the player has no interest.....and signs with another club. TT gets hammered by the fans for not going after this player.... My point is in FA's, there is just so many different facets that need to fit together, and if one is ignored, that deal might not be so much of a deal. After drafting and FA, all other aspects of being a GM finds TT doing a solid job, which is why he is not getting released anytime soon. So what is the problem in the 'people' side? For me it is J Spanos....I just hate having the owners kid that close to decisions that influence so many things. Might be my bias speaking, and I freely admit to the bias. Might be that J Spanos is the one keeping TT from being exposed as a terrible GM, but I think it is the other way around, lose J Spanos and the results you seek show up....but owners do not get fired. The problem will linger until a change in ownership.....get used to status quo.
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Post by lightsout42 on Nov 20, 2021 7:34:16 GMT -7
“[G]et used to status quo.”
You mean mocking the Chargers for being an awful and terribly-managed team? Because that was my status quo after they moved and hired Lynn—after McCoy, Norv, and firing Marty.
As a fan I don’t have to get used to them. They can get used to me. If the owners don’t want to do what it takes to build a good team then my only satisfaction comes from finding ways to cost them money.
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Post by frozendisc on Nov 20, 2021 7:39:00 GMT -7
“[G]et used to status quo.” You mean mocking the Chargers for being an awful and terribly-managed team? Because that was my status quo after they moved and hired Lynn—after McCoy, Norv, and firing Marty. As a fan I don’t have to get used to them. They can get used to me. If the owners don’t want to do what it takes to build a good team then my only satisfaction comes from finding ways to cost them money. As a fan you have that effort at your disposal, clearly..... My 'get used to it' was more about not expecting change from the club, as opposed to any fan changing his/her expectations.
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Post by lazylightning on Nov 20, 2021 7:50:13 GMT -7
Telesco & Staley have a three year window to create a playoff caliber team. Failing to do so; Spanos will wipe the slate clean and start over.
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Post by moekid on Nov 20, 2021 8:37:57 GMT -7
If you’re Spanos and you believe the roster has been deficient for years on end, what do you do? Stick with the same guy who’s been creating the roster? Move on? Or do you really care whether your team wins or not? Is that the most important thing in the world to you or are you ok with occasional winning seasons and an appearance in the playoffs as long as the business of the Chargers is good? What’s the burning priority for Dean Spanos? "What do you do" is the issue.....and there is only one correct answer buried in a ton of incorrect answers. Thirty one clubs get it wrong, and only one gets it right each year. But that is not what most are speaking about here, it is more about becoming that model of consistency.....making the PO's each year, having a shot. Ownership does set the expectation, and if that expectation prioritizes earnings or financial stability, you probably see 'safe' approaches to most all money decisions. I have zero idea what Dean Spanos believes, or wants, from his club. One can look to different sources, and it appears the Chargers spend well above average, or close to the cap for players. Beyond that, it is difficult to determine a financial personality for the Charger organization, if you will allow that term. In the end, I do not believe 'money' or spending is the issue preventing that consistency being sought. So if it is not money, then it is personnel.....do they have the 'right' people. This opens the door for all the criticism directed towards TT, and as the GM it is part of the territory. Decisions....how are they obtained? So with the draft, it is virtually always a collective decision. In fact I have never been in the room and seen a GM, or Owner for that matter, go off script and just decide. It just doesn't happen, there is far too much invested in the process to out of the blue reject that investment. Drafting decisions is easy, the hard one is FA's.... The perfect FA is available, perfect fit, attitude, age.....everything is perfect for your club. GM reaches out to the agent, tells him the vault is open, just tell us how much. Agent replies the player has no interest.....and signs with another club. TT gets hammered by the fans for not going after this player.... My point is in FA's, there is just so many different facets that need to fit together, and if one is ignored, that deal might not be so much of a deal. After drafting and FA, all other aspects of being a GM finds TT doing a solid job, which is why he is not getting released anytime soon. So what is the problem in the 'people' side? For me it is J Spanos....I just hate having the owners kid that close to decisions that influence so many things. Might be my bias speaking, and I freely admit to the bias. Might be that J Spanos is the one keeping TT from being exposed as a terrible GM, but I think it is the other way around, lose J Spanos and the results you seek show up....but owners do not get fired. The problem will linger until a change in ownership.....get used to status quo. That’s a lot of writing. The owner’s kid is Dean. J Spanos is the owner’s grandkid. Neither Dean nor J did anything impressive in their lives to be in the position they are in. It’s all inherited. Looking forward to the sale of the team |
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Post by moekid on Nov 20, 2021 18:40:57 GMT -7
For Freak’s sake, we must win.
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Post by afboltfan on Nov 21, 2021 6:48:42 GMT -7
They are responsible for every single thing in the organization. Everyone they hire is responsible for getting results for the job they are hired to do. If the roster isn’t up to snuff, as you have said for every season, they are responsible for either investing in help that TT needs or replacing him. And so on down the line. That’s how business works I do not believe Dean micromanages the operation. I do believe J Spanos picks his areas he wants to influence, and does so heavily. I have no 'proof' on that, so do not ask. After we acknowledge the 'Owner' is responsible for all, let us get to the brass tacks of this. Yes, this roster has been less than for years, my opinion. The issue is what to do about it. The responses to 'what to do about it' cover the entire spectrum, but the bottom line is TT made his choices (or choices were made) and....this is key.....they liked their choices made. Now hindsight has allowed us to complain or praise the choices, but TT et al do not get the benefit of hindsight prior to making the decisions/choices. That is how real life works.....
*I have always thought there was something systemically wrong in the Chargers scouting of OL, but being this far away.....not a chance I could ever identify it. Maybe it has been fixed, but Slater was a top round one guy, so let me see some success from rounds 3 and 4. You keep saying those things when its already known, I get it, I'm sure alot of other people do to. This does not absolve TT or the organization from criticism.
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Post by frozendisc on Nov 21, 2021 8:59:48 GMT -7
I do not believe Dean micromanages the operation. I do believe J Spanos picks his areas he wants to influence, and does so heavily. I have no 'proof' on that, so do not ask. After we acknowledge the 'Owner' is responsible for all, let us get to the brass tacks of this. Yes, this roster has been less than for years, my opinion. The issue is what to do about it. The responses to 'what to do about it' cover the entire spectrum, but the bottom line is TT made his choices (or choices were made) and....this is key.....they liked their choices made. Now hindsight has allowed us to complain or praise the choices, but TT et al do not get the benefit of hindsight prior to making the decisions/choices. That is how real life works.....
*I have always thought there was something systemically wrong in the Chargers scouting of OL, but being this far away.....not a chance I could ever identify it. Maybe it has been fixed, but Slater was a top round one guy, so let me see some success from rounds 3 and 4. You keep saying those things when its already known, I get it, I'm sure alot of other people do to. This does not absolve TT or the organization from criticism. I also keep saying you, and any fan for that matter, can criticize as much as you wish.
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