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Post by chargerfreak on Mar 27, 2021 2:44:05 GMT -7
Well, bold is one way to describe this. Desperately pretending these WR's are top NFL is another way. Not pretending at all, just saying that he improved. He is already better than Mike Williams and far cheaper... How is that ? 20 catches for 398 and 3 TD's ??
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Post by afboltfan on Mar 27, 2021 4:10:18 GMT -7
Not pretending at all, just saying that he improved. He is already better than Mike Williams and far cheaper... How is that ? 20 catches for 398 and 3 TD's ?? Johnson only played in 12 games, only had 26 targets. He hauled in 20 of those for 398 yards and 3 TD's... He was like 3rd or 4th WR?? Compare that to mediocre Mike Williams? I think Tyron Johnson could be better given the same workload as MW.
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Post by fouts2herbert on Mar 27, 2021 10:23:02 GMT -7
Can anyone make a case for a surprise player? Or is just arguing over MW the thing?
I was wondering if anyone out there can make a case for Trey Pipkins? I don’t have his pff stats or anything that would indicate upward trend with pipkins but I do have 42 years of being a charger fan and I’ve seen guys like this surprise in the past. Guys that have been labeled busts and eventually became average to decent contributors.
He’s got the physical tools, he appears to be dedicated and committed to improving, I see the hustle on replays. The game might slow down for him this year, you never know. From my experience it takes about 3-4 seasons to develop OL to adapt to the NFL. Pipkins is heading into that period were a lot of guys get their man strength around age 25-26. Take Tevi as an example, look how big a jump he made from year 2 to 3, and then last year he was actually a decent player (underrated IMO) in year 4. Pipkins started with a higher floor than Tevi and his ceiling is also higher. So even though I haven’t seen signs of anything specific, I wonder if he doesn’t come in this year provide quality minutes when baluga gets hurt, because baluga will get hurt.
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Post by sonorajim on Mar 27, 2021 10:24:28 GMT -7
Mike had 35 1st downs, Tyron 0. Johnson's ability to stretch the field is appreciated. I'm not convinced he can replace MW's production.
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Post by sonorajim on Mar 27, 2021 10:35:41 GMT -7
I'm 50/50 on Pipkins. It may be the year when he gets it. Some great OL examples, new coaches. Could be! I know I'd be happy to see it.  |
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Post by moekid on Mar 27, 2021 12:49:49 GMT -7
Mike had 35 1st downs, Tyron 0. Johnson's ability to stretch the field is appreciated. I'm not convinced he can replace MW's production. MW is underrated by Charger fans for some reason. I also wonder about the 0 stat for Ty. I mean he caught the 25 yard pass that set up the game winner against Atl. That was a first down |
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Post by joemcrugby on Mar 27, 2021 14:10:02 GMT -7
Mike had 35 1st downs, Tyron 0. Johnson's ability to stretch the field is appreciated. I'm not convinced he can replace MW's production. MW is underrated by Charger fans for some reason. I also wonder about the 0 stat for Ty. I mean he caught the 25 yard pass that set up the game winner against Atl. That was a first down Tyron had 15 first downs and averaged 19.9 yards / reception. He improved as the year progressed, but big-body MDub, Slayer and Henry took a lot of attention away from Johnson. www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JohnTy03.htmI agree that Williams is underrated by a lot of fans because he can be a 1st down machine when healthy, and staying healthy has proved difficult for him. I am hoping to hear about an extension at some point before the draft that lowers his 2021 cap charge because he adds a lot to the Chargers offense with his presence on the field. What worries me is that he often gets hurt going up for acrobatic catches, and that big body hitting the dirt at awkward angles is usually the source of his injuries.
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Post by afboltfan on Mar 27, 2021 14:28:57 GMT -7
Mike Williams is a terrible route runner and has one trait... Run straight up the sideline, throw his body at the ball and hope for a catch. I cringe every time he goes for a catch because you never know if he'll come up injured. Its admirable he seems to give it his all, but he is totally overrated IMHO.
As far as Tyron Johnson, simply following the OP and naming a guy. Johnson was clutch toward the end of the season and I think he can be a "surprise" performer in 2021. Did I mention he'd be cheaper than MW?
Maybe MW should be considered as a surprise player... He does have a contract to earn.
LETS TALK ABOUT ANOTHER STAT speaking of MW and his terrible route running and 1 trick pony run in a straight line up the field...
Mike Williams catch percentage... 56%
Tyron Johnson catch percentage... 76.9%
I admit MW had many more targets, but still significant IMVHO...
Ok I'm done.
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Post by fouts2herbert on Mar 27, 2021 14:47:24 GMT -7
I'm 50/50 on Pipkins. It may be the year when he gets it. Some great OL examples, new coaches. Could be! I know I'd be happy to see it. I can’t think of a single reason he won’t continue to improve, he was supposedly statistically better in 2019 than in 2020 but I don’t agree with that. He flashed at times last year but couldn’t put it together from series to series let alone game to game. Like I said, if Tevi is used as an example for what happens from year 2 to year 3, then pipkins might put some tape out in 2021 that might change our minds about him. The guy was a project from the beginning and the potential is still there and a lot of it, we’ll see.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 27, 2021 18:58:45 GMT -7
Can anyone make a case for a surprise player? Or is just arguing over MW the thing? I was wondering if anyone out there can make a case for Trey Pipkins? I don’t have his pff stats or anything that would indicate upward trend with pipkins but I do have 42 years of being a charger fan and I’ve seen guys like this surprise in the past. Guys that have been labeled busts and eventually became average to decent contributors. He’s got the physical tools, he appears to be dedicated and committed to improving, I see the hustle on replays. The game might slow down for him this year, you never know. From my experience it takes about 3-4 seasons to develop OL to adapt to the NFL. Pipkins is heading into that period were a lot of guys get their man strength around age 25-26. Take Tevi as an example, look how big a jump he made from year 2 to 3, and then last year he was actually a decent player (underrated IMO) in year 4. Pipkins started with a higher floor than Tevi and his ceiling is also higher. So even though I haven’t seen signs of anything specific, I wonder if he doesn’t come in this year provide quality minutes when baluga gets hurt, because baluga will get hurt. Looking simply through a management lens, the steps taken to date, there seems to be high level confidence the OT need is not an issue. Might be they are confident the OT they want in the draft will be there, or they feel Pipkins is an ascending talent. We are just not reading the tea leaves very well......
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 27, 2021 19:09:54 GMT -7
Mike Williams is a terrible route runner and has one trait... Run straight up the sideline, throw his body at the ball and hope for a catch. I cringe every time he goes for a catch because you never know if he'll come up injured. Its admirable he seems to give it his all, but he is totally overrated IMHO. As far as Tyron Johnson, simply following the OP and naming a guy. Johnson was clutch toward the end of the season and I think he can be a "surprise" performer in 2021. Did I mention he'd be cheaper than MW? Maybe MW should be considered as a surprise player... He does have a contract to earn. LETS TALK ABOUT ANOTHER STAT speaking of MW and his terrible route running and 1 trick pony run in a straight line up the field... Mike Williams catch percentage... 56%Tyron Johnson catch percentage... 76.9%
I admit MW had many more targets, but still significant IMVHO... Ok I'm done. Your dislike for MW is clouding your ability to judge all the aspects influencing any given play call, and the results from said play call. If you are the DC, and your defence is defending a 3rd and seven, are you putting your worst DB on KA? No, you are not..... That philosophy impacts every WR stat, every play.....might be good to be an unknown such as Ty Johnson, eh?
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Post by fouts2herbert on Mar 27, 2021 19:52:35 GMT -7
Can anyone make a case for a surprise player? Or is just arguing over MW the thing? I was wondering if anyone out there can make a case for Trey Pipkins? I don’t have his pff stats or anything that would indicate upward trend with pipkins but I do have 42 years of being a charger fan and I’ve seen guys like this surprise in the past. Guys that have been labeled busts and eventually became average to decent contributors. He’s got the physical tools, he appears to be dedicated and committed to improving, I see the hustle on replays. The game might slow down for him this year, you never know. From my experience it takes about 3-4 seasons to develop OL to adapt to the NFL. Pipkins is heading into that period were a lot of guys get their man strength around age 25-26. Take Tevi as an example, look how big a jump he made from year 2 to 3, and then last year he was actually a decent player (underrated IMO) in year 4. Pipkins started with a higher floor than Tevi and his ceiling is also higher. So even though I haven’t seen signs of anything specific, I wonder if he doesn’t come in this year provide quality minutes when baluga gets hurt, because baluga will get hurt. Looking simply through a management lens, the steps taken to date, there seems to be high level confidence the OT need is not an issue. Might be they are confident the OT they want in the draft will be there, or they feel Pipkins is an ascending talent. We are just not reading the tea leaves very well...... I think after this years draft pipkins is going to feel a sense of urgency that perhaps he hasn’t felt before. There is a lot of money out there for guys that can be even average starting/swing OTs It’s gonna come down to him really getting in touch with his nasty dark side and opening up a can of whup a$$ because people are coming for his roster spot this year. He hasn’t felt that the last 2 years. It might just be the wake up he needed which bodes well for our depth especially if the chargers draft a tackle high and another on day 3. Maybe we see a side of pipkins that we hadn’t seen before.
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Post by afboltfan on Mar 27, 2021 20:01:10 GMT -7
Mike Williams is a terrible route runner and has one trait... Run straight up the sideline, throw his body at the ball and hope for a catch. I cringe every time he goes for a catch because you never know if he'll come up injured. Its admirable he seems to give it his all, but he is totally overrated IMHO. As far as Tyron Johnson, simply following the OP and naming a guy. Johnson was clutch toward the end of the season and I think he can be a "surprise" performer in 2021. Did I mention he'd be cheaper than MW? Maybe MW should be considered as a surprise player... He does have a contract to earn. LETS TALK ABOUT ANOTHER STAT speaking of MW and his terrible route running and 1 trick pony run in a straight line up the field... Mike Williams catch percentage... 56%Tyron Johnson catch percentage... 76.9%
I admit MW had many more targets, but still significant IMVHO... Ok I'm done. Your dislike for MW is clouding your ability to judge all the aspects influencing any given play call, and the results from said play call. If you are the DC, and your defence is defending a 3rd and seven, are you putting your worst DB on KA? No, you are not..... That philosophy impacts every WR stat, every play.....might be good to be an unknown such as Ty Johnson, eh? Most definetley, but lets not lose sight of the big picture... I'm simply defending my reasoning for TJ being a "surprise" player this coming season. Yea I think MW is totally overrated by some fans on this board, but I also understand his role on the team and his place on the depth chart.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 27, 2021 20:05:13 GMT -7
Looking simply through a management lens, the steps taken to date, there seems to be high level confidence the OT need is not an issue. Might be they are confident the OT they want in the draft will be there, or they feel Pipkins is an ascending talent. We are just not reading the tea leaves very well...... I think after this years draft pipkins is going to feel a sense of urgency that perhaps he hasn’t felt before. There is a lot of money out there for guys that can be even average starting/swing OTs It’s gonna come down to him really getting in touch with his nasty dark side and opening up a can of whup a$$ because people are coming for his roster spot this year. He hasn’t felt that the last 2 years. It might just be the wake up he needed which bodes well for our depth especially if the chargers draft a tackle high and another on day 3. Maybe we see a side of pipkins that we hadn’t seen before. While I agree that Pipkins will feel pressure to protect his roster spot, I do not agree there is some 'dark' aspect Pipkins can reach for to gain another level in effort. He was a project, and sometimes those work out for you, most times they do not. This should be Pipkins' last year, he either makes the jump, or he doesn't and gets surpassed by a new draft pick. TT needs to not be searching for diamonds in a dark cave. Just spend the high draft pick, and solve the issue. Sewell, Slater.....or Darrisaw, any one of them solves the need.
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Post by frozendisc on Mar 27, 2021 20:10:47 GMT -7
Your dislike for MW is clouding your ability to judge all the aspects influencing any given play call, and the results from said play call. If you are the DC, and your defence is defending a 3rd and seven, are you putting your worst DB on KA? No, you are not..... That philosophy impacts every WR stat, every play.....might be good to be an unknown such as Ty Johnson, eh? Most definetley, but lets not lose sight of the big picture... I'm simply defending my reasoning for TJ being a "surprise" player this coming season. Yea I think MW is totally overrated by some fans on this board, but I also understand his role on the team and his place on the depth chart. TJ is a complimentary WR......might become more than, but to do so would require opportunity, and that means no KA or MW around......not good, eh? I politely suggest you use your 'understanding' to temper your comments about MW. He fills the role he is asked to fill quite nicely.
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